Stocking

Kenny777

Well-Known Member
#1
So my dad said that he might get me a 180gallon tank, so this excited me so i wanted to plan out my stock so I know what im getting. My idea I want to do is an aggressiver stock with larger fish, the only fish that is a definite is a Texas Cichlid and Senegal Bichir. What type of filtration should i run, im thinking about doing a canister and a HOB that I have on my 55g. So any ideas are welcome, doing a similar scape for what i did with my 55g, pool filter sand, river rocks, large pieces of driftwood and fake plants.
 

tunamanphd

Well-Known Member
#3
Pretty much trial and error on picking Aggressive fish to be housed together. Not a fan here of aggressive fish So No help either.
 

Navigator Black

Some odd mod.
Staff member
#6
I have many thoughts. If I had a religion, I would have thoughts and prayers for fish in that Monster Fishkeepers suggested tank.

Congos will die. The firemouth will be too gentle for that crew. Why a convict? Why a female dempsey? To me, the moment you say aggressive, you have handcuffed yourself. A couple of bichirs and a Texas will do for a 120, a 180 or a 360. When I kept moderately aggressive CA Cichlids, I kept asking stocking questions until I heard what I wanted to hear. I then proceeded to create a killing zone... It's what most of us do at least once. We want larger aggressive fish, but if we focus on the welfare of the animal, we can end up with one or two fish in a huge tank. We want lots of fish because they are great to keep, but then we can't keep them together for long after we buy them. It's a hard, sad lesson.
Just to give an idea, in the wild, a three inch, non aggressive kribensis, Pelvicachromis pulcher, can hold a 9 square foot territory. Stop and consider what a huge Texas Cichlid will claim ownership over. It's a battleship in a bathtub.
A salvini and a Texas will live in chronic hatred of each other in a large tank, and a third large cichlid could help spread the hate around a bit. The bichirs get large and come from a totally different habitat than the Cichlids you want, so they may ignore your Texas, and vice versa.
If you accept the Monster guys ideas, I would use a plumbed tank with your 55 as a sump.
A lot of online people are happy to suggest overstocks in other peoples' tanks. The fish in their tanks usually have short, brutish lives, and what I read rarely thinks more than a month into the future. There are no consequences to online advice. Filtering what they suggest would cost an arm and a leg - even if you just go with two large canisters.
 

tyguy37167

Well-Known Member
#7
My guess is that the bichirs will die in that sort of tank. I would expect a senegalus to become a meal for one of the larger cichlids ( considering if you get the standard dinosaur/senegalus and it's tank bread then it likely won't get much more than 10-12 inches and unless you get them at a large size it will be vulnerable). From my recent research, bichirs are less aggressive and more prey driven. So calling them an aggressive fish probably is a mischaracterization. Bichirs don't really have the attitude to defend themselves. If you want to do a bichir i'd go for one of the more aggressive species like the ornates. Now, maybe the cichlids will ignore the bichirs completely and that would be swell but you also need to consider that bichirs take a while to get to their food. A tank with 5 moderate to hyper aggressive cichlids probably would not be an ideal situation for them. The congo tetras will be a meal pretty quick and I'm not sure how the firemouth will survive. Depending on the attitude of the female jack she might not do so well either.
 

Arthur

Well-Known Member
#8
In the old club we had specialists for large cichlids. In the basement. Several cubic meters of water. I was the photographer.
But I do not remember what kind. May be Aequitens ...

 

Kenny777

Well-Known Member
#9
My guess is that the bichirs will die in that sort of tank. I would expect a senegalus to become a meal for one of the larger cichlids ( considering if you get the standard dinosaur/senegalus and it's tank bread then it likely won't get much more than 10-12 inches and unless you get them at a large size it will be vulnerable). From my recent research, bichirs are less aggressive and more prey driven. So calling them an aggressive fish probably is a mischaracterization. Bichirs don't really have the attitude to defend themselves. If you want to do a bichir i'd go for one of the more aggressive species like the ornates. Now, maybe the cichlids will ignore the bichirs completely and that would be swell but you also need to consider that bichirs take a while to get to their food. A tank with 5 moderate to hyper aggressive cichlids probably would not be an ideal situation for them. The congo tetras will be a meal pretty quick and I'm not sure how the firemouth will survive. Depending on the attitude of the female jack she might not do so well either.
Wow thanks for the info! I will do ornates then as I saw some at my lfs. What do you think would be a nice stocking then? I really wanted to do like 4 10-12in cichlids then bottom dwellers but I kept getting mixed opinions on MFK.
 

Kenny777

Well-Known Member
#10
I have many thoughts. If I had a religion, I would have thoughts and prayers for fish in that Monster Fishkeepers suggested tank.

Congos will die. The firemouth will be too gentle for that crew. Why a convict? Why a female dempsey? To me, the moment you say aggressive, you have handcuffed yourself. A couple of bichirs and a Texas will do for a 120, a 180 or a 360. When I kept moderately aggressive CA Cichlids, I kept asking stocking questions until I heard what I wanted to hear. I then proceeded to create a killing zone... It's what most of us do at least once. We want larger aggressive fish, but if we focus on the welfare of the animal, we can end up with one or two fish in a huge tank. We want lots of fish because they are great to keep, but then we can't keep them together for long after we buy them. It's a hard, sad lesson.
Just to give an idea, in the wild, a three inch, non aggressive kribensis, Pelvicachromis pulcher, can hold a 9 square foot territory. Stop and consider what a huge Texas Cichlid will claim ownership over. It's a battleship in a bathtub.
A salvini and a Texas will live in chronic hatred of each other in a large tank, and a third large cichlid could help spread the hate around a bit. The bichirs get large and come from a totally different habitat than the Cichlids you want, so they may ignore your Texas, and vice versa.
If you accept the Monster guys ideas, I would use a plumbed tank with your 55 as a sump.
A lot of online people are happy to suggest overstocks in other peoples' tanks. The fish in their tanks usually have short, brutish lives, and what I read rarely thinks more than a month into the future. There are no consequences to online advice. Filtering what they suggest would cost an arm and a leg - even if you just go with two large canisters.
Okay Nav, thanks for the help! So what do you think would mix with my texas and bichir?
 

tyguy37167

Well-Known Member
#11
Personally, I wouldn't mix large aggressive cichlids with bichirs. For me I'd probably go with some of the larger UJ species like teugs or weeksis and then do large more passive cichlids like severums, chocolates, and heckelii. If you want central I'd try O. heterospila, or maybe breidohri as those are supposed to be pretty passive for centrals. Pearsei and bocourti might also be options in a 180 but they will probably take up most of the room. Of course you could go with smaller cichlids and have more potential options.

Really no one knows for sure what is going to mix well with bichirs and cichlids. You might get a jerk bichir that nips at cichlids but from my limited research it's more likely the cichlids will pick on the bichirs. And the suggestions I have given come from me observing other folks on poly forums and what they keep with their fish and seem to do so with success
 

Kenny777

Well-Known Member
#12
Personally, I wouldn't mix large aggressive cichlids with bichirs. For me I'd probably go with some of the larger UJ species like teugs or weeksis and then do large more passive cichlids like severums, chocolates, and heckelii. If you want central I'd try O. heterospila, or maybe breidohri as those are supposed to be pretty passive for centrals. Pearsei and bocourti might also be options in a 180 but they will probably take up most of the room. Of course you could go with smaller cichlids and have more potential options.

Really no one knows for sure what is going to mix well with bichirs and cichlids. You might get a jerk bichir that nips at cichlids but from my limited research it's more likely the cichlids will pick on the bichirs.
Hmm okay, would it be possible to do my texas and a bunch of peaceful cichlids instead of aggressive? Then the bichirs and maybe something else? Like a black ghost knife fish or an eel?
 

tunamanphd

Well-Known Member
#13
Wow thanks for the info! I will do ornates then as I saw some at my lfs. What do you think would be a nice stocking then? I really wanted to do like 4 10-12in cichlids then bottom dwellers but I kept getting mixed opinions on MFK.
Sevrums - beautiful Fish and pretty docile for cichlids.
 

Kenny777

Well-Known Member
#15
Dang :/ because I have to keep the texas either way so what would be the best tank mates for him? Other large aggressive cichlids like jaguars, jack dempseys, red devil, midas or etc? Could some bichirs and maybe syndontis work for the bottom? Or maybe a pleco?
 

tyguy37167

Well-Known Member
#16
I think any tankmates with a texas is going to be a crapshoot. It will be up to the texas on whether or not they are going to survive.

Personally I would keep it as a wet pet in a 75 or something along those lines and devote the 180 to whatever else you are interested in. But that's just me.
 

Kenny777

Well-Known Member
#17
I think any tankmates with a texas is going to be a crapshoot. It will be up to the texas on whether or not they are going to survive.

Personally I would keep it as a wet pet in a 75 or something along those lines and devote the 180 to whatever else you are interested in. But that's just me.
Hmm okay then, i think I know what im going to do.

I wish i could do that but my father said no. So i would just have to keep researching what im going to do. But i have an idea. Im probably gonna turn my 55g into a reptile tank and the 180g would be my only fish tank. Until I move into a house.
 

Navigator Black

Some odd mod.
Staff member
#18
One of my many theories of fishkeeping :rolleyes: is the limiting Cichlid one. It usually involves hobbyists and dempsies or oscars, but a Texas will do too. The idea is we go for an aggressive species, then realize one fish isn't enough. The problem becomes the aggression of the one fish. It doesn't care how big the tank is, it belongs to him and him alone. Wolf cichlids, dovii, one of the smartest cichlids out there are notorous for this.
The one fish controls the entire situation, and makes communities impossible. It is never a fish we are going to buy - it is a fish we already own. If you buy one of these, you are scr*wed.
I've been there, done that...
 

Kenny777

Well-Known Member
#19
One of my many theories of fishkeeping :rolleyes: is the limiting Cichlid one. It usually involves hobbyists and dempsies or oscars, but a Texas will do too. The idea is we go for an aggressive species, then realize one fish isn't enough. The problem becomes the aggression of the one fish. It doesn't care how big the tank is, it belongs to him and him alone. Wolf cichlids, dovii, one of the smartest cichlids out there are notorous for this.
The one fish controls the entire situation, and makes communities impossible. It is never a fish we are going to buy - it is a fish we already own. If you buy one of these, you are scr*wed.
I've been there, done that...
One of my many theories of fishkeeping :rolleyes: is the limiting Cichlid one. It usually involves hobbyists and dempsies or oscars, but a Texas will do too. The idea is we go for an aggressive species, then realize one fish isn't enough. The problem becomes the aggression of the one fish. It doesn't care how big the tank is, it belongs to him and him alone. Wolf cichlids, dovii, one of the smartest cichlids out there are notorous for this.
The one fish controls the entire situation, and makes communities impossible. It is never a fish we are going to buy - it is a fish we already own. If you buy one of these, you are scr*wed.
I've been there, done that...
Thanks Nav for the help but im not listening to MFK anymore about my stocking, im going add the texas and the other cichlids last all at the same time while i will buy the more peaceful fish first.
 
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